Messages

211

Pond Chat / Re: Just got new waterlilies, today!

« on: June 20, 2011, 05:54:49 PM »

The easy answer would be, "MORE waterlilies!"   

But I think this time it's going to be "Pond building materials."     

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

212

Pond Chat / Just got new waterlilies, today!

« on: June 20, 2011, 12:22:46 PM »

I hope this post is considered appropriate here.

Mail carrier just showed up and had a box for me from Kat. I have to say that I didn't expect it quite so soon, I thought maybe it would be here towards the end of the week. Very nice!

Doing business with Kat was a pure pleasure. Straight forward and very fast. The plants were packed very well and got here in better shape than some I'd gotten in the past from some rather "big-name" sources.

I'd have no problem reccomending buy from Kat, and will likely do so myself again, in the future. I did leave feedback on this transaction, but I'm not too sure how many people actually see that, so I wanted to let people know what I thought about how this particular purchase went, just in case anyone was thinking about buying from the Plant Exchange section of the Forum, and especially if they were thinking about buying from one of Kat's post.

Thank you Kat!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

213

Pond Chat / Re: Question about waterlilies from Thailand.

« on: June 20, 2011, 11:57:14 AM »

I appreciate everyone's replies! Love the free-low of information. I can be included in the class of "I want one of every kind" when it comes to water lilies.

My own experience with the Ebay seller of waterliles from Thailand has been pretty good, over all. A little confusing at times because of the language barrier perhaps. My impression is that he knows much more about sales than he does waterlilies, though. My Jongkolnee tubers got off to a very slow start, but now both plants seem to be growing well. (One is in a one gallon pot, the other in an 18 oz. plastic cup.)

I've discovered that the first few blooms of the Nangkwags from that source look a little strange, not opening fully, falling over before it fully opens, that sort of thing, but the blooms that follow look and act just fine. I should have expected this, as I was told long ago that the first pads a watelily produces and it's first bloom should will often be a poor indicator of what the mature plant will look like.

Patience is a virtue, it's just never been one of mine.

I hope I've made it clear in my intoductory post in the "getting to know you" section, as well as a few other post that I am now a hobbyist, but have every intention of turning my hobby into what will become a retirement business. I do want to be very open and above board about that.

I have decided I will include some of the varieties that I've gotten from Thailand in my inventory, simply because I find that I like these plants. Of course, I realize that they will not suit everyone's taste, but that's true about most things.

While I'm working with these new (to me) waterlilies, I'll post anything I learn about getting them to perform well. One thing I do know is that if you are willing to get, you must be equally willing to give.

Again, many thanks!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

214

Pond Chat / Question about waterlilies from Thailand.

« on: June 19, 2011, 12:42:19 PM »

I first saw Nangkwaug (or Indian Goddess) waterlilies and others such as Jongkolnee, while searching through the archives of the IWLS on-line. I was looking for something different as opposed to the usual available from the big-name suppliers. (Although I have to say there are many more varieties available now that there was 19 years ago.)

The only place I found to get some of these more "exotic" plants was a shop on EBay that sells live plants directly from Thailand. Nice enough guy when you get to know him a bit, but not very knowledgeable about the plants. (That may not be entirely accurate, it could be at least partially due to something of a language barrier.)

Now that I've spent a little time on this forum, I see where quite a few people do have some of these waterlilies. I'm very curious about  where you found them. I am always on the lookout for different, less commonly know waterlilies.

Anyone care to point me in the right direction to these sources? Preferably sources that understand the importance of accurate identity of the plants?

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

215

Pond Chat / Re: Yet another net warning

« on: June 19, 2011, 12:26:40 PM »

Bleeding from the gills is common for a jumper, even more so with female Koi. The females will often bleed a little from the gills after being transported to a show, or sometimes just from being bowled for inspection. The bleeding usually stops fairly quickly.

Can be physical wound, not doesn't have to be. Think stress reaction. I'd do nothing to increase the stress level at this time.

Yes, you are right on about the importance of netting any temporary containment. The soft net cover that is made for a show tank is a good type to use. In fact, a standard show tank is an excellent, if expensive thing to have on hand for temporary containment, such a quarantine, holding, or a treatment tank. Some treatments may stain the tank, but it is great for keeping fish safe. And it does store in a small package.

To keep Koi in temporary containment from jumping, not only should it be netted, some floating cover will help keep them calm, providing them with a place to hide. I've used  plastic garbage can lids with a small block of foam under them as "giant lily pads." A few of those in a tank provides both cover and shade. Should a fish jump on top, they will not be stuck up there, they will simply slide back into the water. A large piece of foam floating on the surface will also give them cover and shade,  but consider breaking it into square foot pieces so they don't become a "Koi raft."

Either will work, and you can easily move them or lift them a bit to give the fish a visual inspection.

As you can guess, this advice comes under the heading of "I've killed enough Koi to know."

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

216

Pond Chat / Re: From Thailand

« on: June 19, 2011, 05:22:35 AM »

What I think you are refering to are actually "sepals." This is whay covers the flower when it is closed. It is the unusual sepals that make the Nangkwaug or Indian Goddess distinctly different from other waterlilies. They appear to be like fingers cupping the flower.

Looks llike the next one to bloom is going to be the blue one. The red will follow a week or two later. I'll post pictures when they do. But today or tomorrow, the Mungkala Ubon will be blooming.   

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

217

Aquatic and Terrestrial Plant Exchange / Re: Hardies & Tropicals on SALE

« on: June 18, 2011, 01:08:56 PM »

Thanks for your fast work!    Got the shipping notice, will let you know when they arrive.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

218

Pond Construction & Filtration / Re: Building new pond, would like some help.

« on: June 18, 2011, 01:05:40 PM »

There is always free advice available on the Internet. And you certainly get what you pay for!   

Sounds like you are doing a fine job looking ahead and paying attention to where the Devil hides. (In the details, of course.) Good on ya!

What does get overlooked is the simple fact that very often, the best advice is local advice. The need to avoid excessive rain water in the pond is more-or-less universal when it comes to Koi ponds. Ponds primarily for waterlilies, not so much. But dealing with snow on the roof? I live in Florida. So that's something I don't normally consider and would not take it into consideration. Groundwater being a problem? Yes, I've seen it once in a while, but in my area, the norm is to see water 6 inches deep in the yard during a downpour, and within 15 minutes of the rain stopping, it vanishes completely. Very high perculation rate. Need sand for concrete work? Dig down 2 feet and there's an endless supply of very fine "sugar sand."

Local advice can save you a lot of trouble, outside advice can help you with seeing things that you might be too close to you.

Looking forward to watching your progress!

Mike S. (Expert at nothing, student of just about everything.)
Spring Hill, FL

219

Pond Chat / Re: When is it too hot?

« on: June 16, 2011, 06:51:09 PM »

Professor Pain is the best teacher. Or as Brett Rowley used to say when asked why he did something a particular way and someone would ask how he knew that, "I've killed enough Koi to know." May sound harsh, but I learned exactly what he meant by that, myself.

I much prefer learning from the mistakes of others. Too bad it doesn't always work out that way. But if you at least share your mistakes, you can help others avoid "Prof. Pain's" class.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

220

Aquatic and Terrestrial Plant Exchange / Re: Hardies & Tropicals on SALE

« on: June 16, 2011, 02:50:20 PM »

Sent PM!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

221

Aquatic and Terrestrial Plant Exchange / Re: Red, White and Purple tropical lilies $20

« on: June 16, 2011, 02:34:14 PM »

If these are still available, just tell me what to do. I would like to have that set.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

222

Aquatic and Terrestrial Plant Exchange / Re: Hardies & Tropicals on SALE

« on: June 16, 2011, 11:34:50 AM »

I think I've been looking for you all along and just didn't know it!   
Let me look some of these up and I'll PM you with a list.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

223

Pond Chat / Re: Tropicall waterlily, but NO idea what it is!

« on: June 16, 2011, 07:51:35 AM »

Thanks for the interest in figuring this one out!

No, not a known plant with a lost tag. At least not one I remember ever having. What was in that pond, and the one right next to it was Trudy Slocum, Red Flare, Emily Grant Hutchings, Mexicana, AlberGreenbergrg, Arc en ciel, Blue Bedazzled, Daubin and maybe Panama Pacific. Night bloomers, day bloomers, tropicals and hardies.

As best as I can recall, I never actually had a pink tropical. Both these ponds were in a PVC framed greenhouse. When I gave up the hobby maybe 10 years back, the greenhouse was uncovered, one pond went dry (more-or-less,) the other retained water but collected a thick layer of oak leaves. Now my interest has rekindled and all that was seen in those ponds were Mexicana. Lots of them. I started removing the oak leaves and located a number of dormant tubers. Some rather small, some quite large, mostly all appeared to be tropicals.

Here's the requested pics:



The underside of the pad. Veins are very distinct. That is also the flower in question, it looks more light-purple due to the low light picture. The picture in the original post is much more accurate for the flower's color. The flower has 4 sepals.





Top of the pad. Again, the color isn't quite well shown, these pics were taken while the pond was in the early morning, shaded by the house. But the mottling is flecked, a light purple, on a somewhat light-green pad. The sinus is almost, but not quite closed. This is true of all it's pads. The edge of the pad is serrated, typical of tropicals. It shows no tendency of being viviparous.

One odd thing, I've seen two growths, that resemble the runner that a Mexicana puts out, in the pot. The look almost like a stem that comes up out of the soil and loops back down into it. But I have not seen a new plant coming up where that loop goes back into the soil, as I would expect with a Mexicana sending out a runner. This could be just a root that arched up and back down, but I don't recall having seen that before in any other pot. When I re-pot this one, I'll take a closer look at that.

As far as I know, Mexicana is the only waterlily that reproduces by sending out runners.

Again, thanks for the interest!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

224

Pond Construction & Filtration / Re: Input strainers for larger pumps ?

« on: June 15, 2011, 06:40:50 PM »

As a general rule, an external pump should have some sort of strainer basket. When I had 6 Koi ponds, the only external pump that burned out on me was the only one without a strainer. And all of them followed a gravity fed settlemt chamber, vortex, or biofilter.

The one that did burn up was a Grunfos recirculating pump. Admittedly not often used for Koi ponds. But it drew very little amps and moved a lot of water! What killed it was little more than a small bit of string algea. Those pumps were made for clean water.

Unless whatever section your pump is drawing from is always covered, there's always be a chance of something getting in and heading for the pump.

Guess that's why so many external pumps are bundled with an intake strainer. If not, they usualy tell you which one can be added to the pump.

I just think having one is a good idea.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

225

Pond Construction & Filtration / Re: Building new pond, would like some help.

« on: June 15, 2011, 06:31:29 PM »

One thing I see that makes a little nervous is the roof line looking like it will dump right into the pond. Maybe a gutter to divert the flow? Large amount of rain water can play havoc with your water chemistry, especially if your area is subject to acid rain.

Other than that, looks like one heck of a project and one that's looking good!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

226

Pond Chat / Re: Tropicall waterlily, but NO idea what it is!

« on: June 15, 2011, 06:22:33 PM »

Thanks for the comment!

I will start going thru the books and see if it matches anything. I will grow out several more and keep some tubers in reserve. Could wind up laying claim to it, I guess. If nothing else, it has certainly sparked my interest in creating hybrids!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

227

Pond Chat / Re: Waterfall in progress Picture

« on: June 15, 2011, 04:46:09 PM »

That is coming along nicely!!!   

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

228

Pond Chat / Re: When is it too hot?

« on: June 15, 2011, 04:44:41 PM »

The extra air stones are a VERY good idea for the fish!  As water temps increase, oxygen saturation levels decrease. Water temps above 80F simply can't hold much oxygen. Should the water temp go very much higher, the saturation point (the most oxygen the water can hold,) comes very close to the minimun reqired to support fish life.

Any surface disturbace will help, such as a waterfall or "pond spitter," but the best way to get additional oxygen into the water is a spray bar. Just a PVC pipe with a cap on one end, the other adapted to a hose attached to a small, submersible pump. You can ether drill a series of small holes in the pipe, or make a number of cuts with a thin saw blade. Just keep the openings in a line so they all shoot water in the same general direction.

Rather than spray into the air, where it might give you a little cooling effect but increase evaporative loss, aim this puppy down to where it makes the most noise. (Fine-tuning.) The more racket it makes, the better job its doing.

Myself, I've not seen tropical waterliles suffer from too much heat, as long as the pond doesn't dry out. But hardies don't all care for so much direct sun down in the South. Most of the time, they will do better in somewhat deeper water. My old mentor used to tell me that "The crown can get sunburn!" Hardies and tropicals. That's why he advised me to make ponds with a 24 inch depth, rather than what was the common 18 inches.

Oh, and Koi absolutely can get sunburn. The answer there would be shade, possibly from plants or a shade cloth pergola, and depth. Very little (if any) UV penitrates 4 feet of water.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

229

Pond Chat / Re: From Thailand

« on: June 15, 2011, 12:12:00 PM »

For Kat,

Yes, aka: Indian Goddess. The blooms are getting a bit better, so I took anothe pic.



Some of the other plants are now putting buds into the air, higher than that one and the stems looks sturdier as well. I'll get on the aphid problem, this evening.

For Marie,

I think that breeder is probably Dr. Slearmlarp Wasuwat. His daughter, Primlarp, has been very helpful to me. Very nice lady! From her, the following on colors:

Khao - White
Dang - Red
Fah- Blue
Muang - Purple-Blue, as well as a variety of related hues
Luenag - Yellow
Chompoo - Pink
Sadd  - Orange (Sometimes spelled "Sad," but I'd hate to call a waterlily "Sad!"

Near as I can tell, the color generally follows the plant name, such as, Nangkwaug Chompoo.
She is also the source for my spelling of "Nangkwaug," as opposed to the often used "Nangkwag"
or "Nang Kwag."

I do have her name-sake night bloomer, Primlarp. Still growing, will post when she, uh, it blooms.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

230

Pond Chat / Re: Darned fish are eating the hyacinth

« on: June 14, 2011, 01:16:25 PM »

I've used a semi-rigid plastic netting to contain floating plants in the past. Usually with a "pool noodle" float ring. One advantage to containing hyacynths this way is that they bloom much more readily when bunched together, much more so than when floating about individually.

Of course, being in Florida, the water hyacinth is a strict "No-No." Invasive species and all that. The water lettuce is (or used to be, anyway," kind of a grey area plant. You could keep it, but not sell it, except for export to states than they are legal in.

If you need to rejuvinate either, remove them from the pond and put them in a tub of water with some liquid fertilizer for a week or so. They should perk right up.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

231

Pond Chat / From Thailand

« on: June 14, 2011, 01:07:58 PM »

I'm still deciding how I feel about this odd-ball waterlily. It is Nangkwaug Khao. (Khao means "white.") The picture isn't very good, I'll post another when I take one. What you can't see is that the tips of the petals are pink, and the petals are edged in pink, as well.

The first couple of blooms were partially submerged, the next was at the surface like a hardy, but now they are being held higher out of the water as they should be. (It is a tropical.) I think part of the problem is aphids, as they can deform both pads and flowers. I should have those little buggers under control quite soon.

If they do get to where the flowers are held well above the water and they do open fully, then I think I'll decide they are "keepers."   



This one has rather heavily mottled pads. Some of the others (yet to bloom,) have less purple, but the purple is larger, more like bands. Hope the pic isn't too big.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

232

Pond Chat / Tropicall waterlily, but NO idea what it is!

« on: June 14, 2011, 11:42:59 AM »

I salvaged some tubers from my old greenhouse pond and started potting them up. I pretty much know what I had, so I thought I'd be able to ID these waterlilies as they bloomed. But now I have a mystery on my hands. . .  Could be a pond hybrid I suppose. I've always wanted to create my own new waterliles, but I didn't think about them doing all the work for me!

Does this look like it could be any named waterlily that you can think of?



The mottled pads seen do belong to the flower. The other plain green pads belong to it's  pond mate, a Daubin. Whatever it is, I like it. And I do have serval growing now, along with more corms, now with small pads, floating about one of the new patio ponds. So any ideas on just what this one is would be appreciated.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

233

Pond Chat / Re: New Member from Spring Hill, FL

« on: May 27, 2011, 10:20:39 AM »

I haven't looked at how to post pics here, but what I've seen is rather straight forward. I'll give it a try, later on. But what I should have pointed out is that I do have pics of the ponds and some of the waterlilies posted on my web site. If you want to see what I'm up to before I figure out posting pics here, you can see them on my web site, named "PT Ponds," as that describes the construction method that I've adapted.

The site is :  http://www.ptponds.com

I will learn how and post other pics that I don't put on the web site, right here in the Forum. But now, I have to get busy as my 3-day work week begins. (That 7P to 7A thing I mentioned earlier.)

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

234

Pond Chat / Re: New Member from Spring Hill, FL

« on: May 26, 2011, 05:17:34 PM »

Well, thanks! Y'all sure make a guy feel welcome here.

The old greenhouse was where I kept Some tropical waterlilies over winter, and more than a few kept blooming, year round. But is primary function was to let me get new plants started, very early in the season. The room was limited, but I could get quite a few going early, and blooming often before the water in the outside ponds was warm enough to accept them.

The two tanks in there are not large, only about 3ft. wide, but they were somewhere around 14 ft long (I think.) One of them was mostly in-ground, the other was all above ground. Don't recall the real reason for that, but I suspect that after I dug out the in-ground one, I simply wanted to avoid the shovel for a while. 

The actual greenhouse is a very simple structure. PVC pipe frame covered with a heavy visqueen. (Spelling?) Heck, clear plastic sheeting! I found it could go two years fairly well without replacement. But only after I put up a leaf net barrier to keep the cats off the roof!

It's a modified version of a plan I found on the Internet. I think mines a bit stronger than the plan version, even though I used 1/2 PVC. I'll get a pic up when I find an old one, if not, I'll post one when I rebuild that part.

Some of you might know me from other forums in the past. Others are just now learning that I tend to be a bit "wordy" in my post.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

http://www.ptponds.com

235

Pond Chat / New Member from Spring Hill, FL

« on: May 26, 2011, 08:24:33 AM »

Just wanted to stop in and say, "Hello!"

I recently put up my own small web site and asked about putting a link to American Ponders. Got the OK, (thanks, Sean!) and decided to follow Sean's suggestion of participating in the Forum. Not sure just what I might add to it, as I find myself in a learning mode. But, you never know!

I work nights, Fri, Sat, and Sun, 7 PM to 7 AM. Suits me just fine, as it gives me most of the week to do whatever I do. Right now, that means getting my ponds in order. By that, I mean the 4 Patio Ponds I just built, based on Sean's display pond design, but somewhat "over-built" to suit me. Also, I have an old aquatic greenhouse, nothing fancy, it covered a pair of "production ponds," each about 3 ft by 14 ft, about 2 ft deep, one in-ground, the other above ground. More of a resurrection than a restoration, as they have been "out-of-service," to put it politely, for about 10 years.

But, that's part of the fun, growing out what survived that 10 year period and trying to identify them!

I gotta stop right here! I posted far more than anyone would want to know about me down in the "Getting to know you" section of the Forum.

Also, I really have to get outside, feed the cats, and get that dried up pond cleaned out and and filled up with water, today. Looks like rain tomorrow and what a mess that could turn into!

I'll check back in, later today.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL