Author Topic: Jongkolnee growing.  (Read 2307 times)

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Offline Mike S.

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Jongkolnee growing.
« on: June 29, 2011, 11:48:07 AM »
My first attempt at growing Jonkolnee was cut short while I kept the pair of very small tubers, about the size of a lotus seed, in a pot of water, waiting to see if maybe I could tease more than one plant from each of them. The got eaten by a raccoon!

I got another pair of these tiny tubers and was much more protective when I kept them in a pot of pond water, waiting for signs of growth. They came it with almost none. Finally, one produced a little plantlet and some roots. This one went into a 4 inch pot, thinking that if it grew, there'd be a good chance at producing more tubers in the smaller pot. The other tuber took a couple of weeks longer before it showed enough growth to plant and that one went into a larger pot to give me a better idea of what the "full-sized" plant was like.

I've since been told that the key to getting Jonkolnee to bloom is plenty of sun and room to spread.

Here is a picture of the one planted first, in the 4 inch pot.



The Jongkolnee is in the center. It's pads are spreading way out. There seems to be one right over each the Mungkala Ubons in the small, rectangular containers, and more of it's pads heading towards the rest of the waterlilies in the small pots and cups.

As those pads spread, I'll likely move the other plants inside the spread, to give the Jongkolnee all the room it wants. And yes, that is a kiddie pool. Got caught short when I was to have put in the first pair of production ponds, but I wanted to get more plants in the water and growing, right away. Round pools like this are not my favorite way to grow water lilies, but they do get the job done.

I'm not putting the inexpensive little pools down, as I've used them in the past to grow out a rather large Gigantea, with several other smaller waterlilies happily growing inside it's spread, and even spawned Koi in them (not such a good idea,) and hatched out the resultant fry in the same pool. (That worked OK.)

What I don't like about a round "pond" like the kiddie pool is that it makes it hard to tend to the plants in them. You pretty much have to wade in and that is kind of difficult when it starts getting tight in there, pads get pushed around and tangled and pots get overturned. This is why I much prefer and 4X8 (or longer) grow-out pond for waterlilies. And I like mine above ground, too. This set-up allows for easy maintenance of the plants without wading and bending at the knees too much.

I'll post more pics as the Jongkolnee grows and of course, when it blooms. It will be interesting to see the difference between the two plants when they bloom, since one is in a very small pot, the other a larger one.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

Offline Vickie

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #1 on: June 29, 2011, 06:50:00 PM »
I am so jealous I have tried 4 and every time I loose the tuber or it dies back.

Offline Marie Fisher

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #2 on: June 29, 2011, 06:55:35 PM »
Very interesting. Please keep pictures coming as to Jonkolknee's progress. Primlarp herself told me that this
lilie requires a lot of room.  And she is successfully blooming one, but then it's a native Thia plant.  My story
is got tubers back winter. Friend said oh put in jar in south window.I did; they sprouted, floating leaves --- and
then promptly went down.  I now have them in pot in a tub so I won't lose the tubers they're so little. And am
to the stage on one tuber of one floating leaf. Do you have any sage advice for me on where to go next on
this plant?  If you do, would sure appreciate hearing it.  I oinly wish mine looked as well as yours does.Yours is
going to make it. Mine -- doubtful!! You didn't say if you'd given it any fertilizer.  That's good question, maybe you
can tell us now.

Marie Fisher

Offline Mike S.

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #3 on: June 30, 2011, 08:13:52 AM »
Marie,

Yes, we both are getting the same info from Primlarp. And she is probably the best source for this particular subject, too. Did you know that Richard Sacher wrote an article on Jongkolnee that was in the May/June 1998 Pond & Garden Magazine? (Vol 1, Number 1, page 92.) It is pretty informative. I got it in a pdf, I think from an archive on the Water Gardeners International web site. If you don't have it and can't find it, let me know, I can email you the file.

I kept both tubers in a pot sitting on a plastic milk crate, in one of my patio ponds. This put it about half-way to the surface. They sat there for several weeks before showing signs of growth. One tuber started sprouting fairly well, the other just a single little pad. I abandon my idea of chain propagation on instinct. (Later, I learned that would likely have been a mistake.)

The onevigorousigorus tuber developed a number of  small pads and sent out quite a few little roots. This one was planted in a small, 4 inch Lerio pot. In the bottom of that pot went about 1/3 cap full of Red Diamond prills. (Nutricote, the 270? day formula.) The pot was filled with a mix of bagged topsoil and my own sandy Florida soil. The tuber was pushed down in the soil mix so only the very tip with the pads was still exposed, the roots just under the soil. A thin layer of pure sand topped it off. No other fertilizer was added at that time.

The second tuber only developed a second pad after another week. I lost my nerve and potted it the same way, but in a one gallon squat pot. Both of these were set on a milk crate, so the top of the pots were probably 4 to 6 inches below the surface.

I am now convinced that if I'd kept the tubers much higher in the water when they were sitting in the empty pot, they would have started growing quite a bit sooner.

The first plant (4in pot,) started sending pads up to the surface fairly quickly. Once they were there and had spread a bit, I lowered that pot to the bottom and gave it part of the pond tab. The other one, (1gal pot,) just sat there, it even lost one of the pads. I kept watching it, even having to fan a growth ofalgae green algea from it that had begun covering what little growth there was.

A few days later, that one began to grow. When it's pads had spread about a foot, I lowered it to the bottom, giving it a full pond tab.

This was when Primlarp posted her comments about the need for full sun and plenty of room to spread. Rather than wait a couple of weeks to put in my 1st pair of "production ponds," I decided to throw up a kiddie pool and get that small pot with the Jongkolnee into it. When I did, I added a pair of pond tabs to the pot.

This brings us to the present. The "kiddie pool plant" is doing fine, the other is too, but will probably get it's own kiddie pool very soon. I think the 8ft diameter will be sufficient and the rather shallow depth, avg. about 15 inches, will help provide the warmth it needs.

So, what I think I've learned is that the very small tubers can as Richard says, be treated like seeds and planted with just the very tip at the surface of the soil. I will continue sprouting them first, in small tubs just under the surface in full sun.

Early growth like all tropicals can be helped by keeping the plant very shallow until 4 or more pads have reached the surface and have spread.

The Red Diamond (or Nutricote) can be put in early on, because it won't start releasing fertilizer for at least a month, and then only if the temp in the pot has reached about 70* or so.

When the pads do start their spread, a pond tab can be safely added. By the time it's gone, the prills should take over. Additional pond tabs can be added if/when needed. I'm still experimenting on using the Nutricote, by the way. So far, I've decided that the label amount of 3/4 cap full per gallon is too low for the plants I've used it on, so far.

As the Jongkolnee grows, I'll be posting more pictures.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

Offline tugo

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2011, 08:21:27 AM »
Will be very informative. Thanks.

Offline Mike S.

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2011, 12:29:09 PM »
Just noticed I said I'd be trying out Nutricote 270 prills, sold as Red Diamond. WRONG!

My bad! It is sold as "Red Dynamite Plant Food” (For Flowers & Vegetables). This is actually Nutricote Type 270, 13x13x13 with Micronutrients.

Might explain why I had a hard time finding it, myself!   :wub:

My use is based on an article in the WGI Journal, by Steve Stroupe. That one was in Vol. 4, number 3, Aug. 2009. Like I said above, I do think the "dose" is a little mild and probably should be increased.
 
Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

Offline Kat

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2011, 12:50:11 PM »
Good luck.  I've admired the pics of that lily on ebay.
Kat

There is never enough room for all of the water lilies that I want ;-)

Offline Mike S.

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #7 on: July 01, 2011, 07:02:37 PM »
Don’t mind saying that's where I got mine.  Kind of scary, just a pair of tubers about the size of a Lotus seed.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

Offline Vickie

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #8 on: July 01, 2011, 07:19:17 PM »
thanks  so much for posting all this info. Mine has sprouted again.

Offline matherfish

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #9 on: July 04, 2011, 10:29:31 AM »
Great info, Mike, and thanks for sharing! And  @O@ @O@ Congratulations!  @O@ @O@ on your success so far.

Offline Mike S.

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #10 on: July 05, 2011, 06:02:21 AM »
So far. . .   Yes, hmmmmmm.

The beginning of this particular adventure didn't start out very well. I got them out of the package and as is my practice, put them in a gallon pot of water. Since they didn't float, I put a rock in the pot with them, and place the pot on a milk crate in the pond for a few days. Not much happened, the water was sort of cool, so I put the pot down on the patio so the water would heat up more and hopefully, they would sprout and I would plant them.

But, a raccoon ate them. At least, I think that's what got them. Pretty sure it wasn't the cats, as they tend to leave whatever sits in the bottom of a pot of water right where it is.

The two plants I have growing now are from the second pair of tubers I bought.

Since that happened, I've made a corral of sorts, just a spot in the yard with a wire fence around it where I now put anything I think the raccoons might have an interest in.

So far, so good!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL


Offline Mike S.

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2011, 10:12:41 AM »
Progress report, so far.

Both Jongkolnee are growing well, but I thought I'd have something more exciting to report. The plant that was started first, the one in the small pot, put up it's first bud!

Unfortunately, it was about 4 inches from the surface when the "monsoon" hit. Day after day of heavy cloud cover, lots of rain, and very little sun, if any. I stepped into the little pool it's growing in during that time and was very surprised at how cold the water was in the morning.

I think, that due to the lower water temp whiched really dropped at night, and the lack of sun, is probably responsible for the failure of that bud to open. It is just above the surface of the water and has been so for several days now. It has now begun to fall to the side, just as flower does after it has been open for a while and is spent. So, no joy on that front.

But, it did produce a bud, so it should do it again, now that we are starting to get at least some sun daily. Once this weather system has passed by, I'm betting that I will be able to post a picture of Jongkolnee blooming.

The other plant, in a larger pot, got it's start several weeks behind the first one. No bud showing yet, but provided the weather improves, it shouldn't be much longer before it does.

I didn't want anyone to think I only post success stories. That's not my way. When I get a topic running, I'll post the good, bad, and the indifferent. It's a simple fact, I learn much more from my failures than from my sucesses.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

Offline Vickie

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2011, 12:04:10 PM »
Pics please.

Offline Mike S.

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #13 on: July 13, 2011, 04:59:23 PM »
Ouch! It never occured to me anyone would want to see a picture of a failed bloom.  :redface:
My bad! Just went out and took one, so here you go.



To the left of the bud, that odd-looking floating thing is just some Elodea floating loose in the pond with a little algea on it. The pond now has a green tint to it. Some of what you see around the waterliles in the back is reflections of nearby trees and bushes. Photo taken late in the evening.

Just to make myself feel better, here is another picture on the little pool next door.



This one was put up a few days ago and most of the plants were just potted, yesterday. All except for the little Red Flare and the one in the center, my other Jongkolnee. This one is in a larger pot.

Don't despair! This pool will go green, soon! And after a couple of weeks, they both will clear up again, first one, then the other about 2 weeks later.

And hopefully, while they are going thru their cycles, I'll have pictures of Jongkolnee blossoms to post!   8)

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

Offline Vickie

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #14 on: July 13, 2011, 07:37:18 PM »
Thank you. Mine has 5 floating leaves, I am loving this thread Mike.

Offline Mike S.

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2011, 12:48:36 PM »
The second bloom on the Jongkolnee has also failed to bloom. Just as seen in the last picture, it looks like the stem could not support the weight as it grew and it laid over. It did try to curve up at the bud end, but the bud was in the water too long.

Here is what it looked like on it's third day at the surface. Looks like it tried to open, but had already started to decompose.



I did cut the first one open and it looked like it had started to rot on the inside, much as I suspect this one did.

My current thought on this is that the water is just too shallow for this plant. I do not think this problem is related to the pot size. Since the last picture was taken, I've moved it into one of my patio ponds for deeper wate, after shuffling some plants around. It's too crowded in there for the Jongkolnee, but next week I'll have an 8X8 pond for it, ready to go. There is another bud started down at the crown.

Then we'll see what happens!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

Offline Vickie

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #16 on: July 21, 2011, 01:04:27 PM »
Maybe it is just immature and the stem is too weak. Maybe as it gets growing more it will be stronger and support the bud. I am hoping to see a beautiful bloom.

Offline Mike S.

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Re: Jongkolnee growing.
« Reply #17 on: July 21, 2011, 01:37:40 PM »
I'm hoping to see a beautiful bloom, too!

But no other tropical of mine has had this particular problem. And I'm only guessing about the water depth being the problem. But, a little more depth certainly won't hurt, so it's worth a try.

I'll give it two more buds to produce a bloom. If that fails, I will repot into a 2 1/2 gallon pot, after the larger pond is ready next week.

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

 

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