Container Water Garden - Will it work?

[Lisa816]

I found a big pot without any predrilled holes, and I thought it might work for a container water garden.  I would like to put a single lotus, wishing for a Momo Botan, if I can find one.  Anyway, when I got home and measured the pot - it wasn't as big as it actually looked in the store (at the bottom anyway).  It is 16" tall, 17" wide at the top, but it is only 10" wide at the bottom of the pot.  See in the picture how it tapers at the bottom. 

Will this pot work for a lotus, or any other kind of water plant?  I was planning to put soil directly in the bottom of the pot, cover with a layer of pea gravel, and fill the top part with water.  Can I use this pot for a water garden?

It's still too muddy here to start digging the pond.  Plans were to get it done this weekend, but the terrible storm we had this week put those plans on hold. 

[tinkster]

hello there...

Hopefully some of the more experienced will chime in but with my lotus, I cant imagine any of them doing well in that pot.  Even my baby doll which was a minature was in a pot over twice that size diameter as youir 10" at the bottom.  I think you could do very well with like taro or some type of tall margial then a water celery or hyacinth floating.  anyway.. hope this helps and am sure the others will be able to help you better than me.

tinkster

[SueSTx]

This is my second year to try lotus.

Lawanna told me the smaller lotus do fine in a 10 gal pot or a 5 gallon bucket in a pinch.

I planted my Momo Batan in a pot exactly like that.  It has a few nickle size leaves now.  I hope it survives me and the weather.

[karen J]

Hi Lisa. I have a pot exactly like that one! The pic is from '02, but these plants did very well. I had to trim the lilypads often (so they wouldn't get too crowded), but it worked out well.



I think if you had a real small lotus, it might work if you fill the pot 3/4 full with dirt to take advantage of the upper diameter of the pot. You only really need around 4-6  inches of water over the dirt. More inches may be better, but it's worth a shot.

[Joyce]

Personally, I wouldn't even grow a Baby Doll in that.
Little lilies would be fine. 

I don't grow ANY lotus in anything smaller than a half barrel width, or about 24".
This is just my opinion. 
But then again, I am not happy with a few blooms a year.
I like to have constant, multiple daily blooms from June through September.
And that is what I get when I use big pots, composted manure, Osmocote.
With bigger pots, there is enough nutrients to sustain a long season of blooms.

[Lisa816]

Thanks for all the replies.    

If I can ever find my dream lotus - a Momo Botan - I'm going to give her one of those big 20 gallon barrel liner pots.  Maybe she'll really spread out and put out lots of flowers like Joyce said.  I know I can find the barrel liner pots at Lowes for $20 (I just got one to make the skippy filter for my pond).  Weirdest thing is that no one sells the whiskey barrels that the liners fit in anymore.  I've seen them in years past at Lowes, Wal-Mart, nurserys, etc.  This year none to be found anywhere.  Lowes said they weren't getting them this year and Wal-Mart said the same thing.  I started calling around to Nurserys looking for them and found out that no one can get them this year.  They said there is a shortage of them and no one has them for sale.   

Anyway, I think I'll try some other plants in the pot I bought, maybe a marginal as was suggested.  I do love the taro plants.  Are the taro plants that are sold at pond stores actually different plants than the ones sold at nurserys, other than the way they are potted? 

Karen, I loved seeing the picture of your pot.  How many plants are in there?  Are they planted directly in that pot or in individual pots?  It is very beautiful and inspiring!!!  Thanks for sharing it.   

[Jonna]

I think any Taro will grow in water, they may grow bigger in dirt but they all grow in water. I've put all kinds of them in the skippy filter and they all got huge. 

[Cedric]

They grow lotus in tiny pots here in Asia, in pure fertile grey clay, no problems, flower all summer. There are also small varieties that are very suitable. Its not the height that matters really it's the diameter. They prefer wide and shallow rather than upright and deep. The water just needs to cover the surface. The tubers needs to go around and around, so avoid square

[tinkster]

Hey lisa.. go here and http://www.americanponders.com/forum/index.php?board=8.0 that is the tutorial section.  JOyce and lawanna both have all the answers to your questions there posted on how to pot lotus.  Hope this helps.

tinkster

[karen J]

Thanks for all the replies.    

 Weirdest thing is that no one sells the whiskey barrels that the liners fit in anymore.  I've seen them in years past at Lowes, Wal-Mart, nurserys, etc.  This year none to be found anywhere.  Lowes said they weren't getting them this year and Wal-Mart said the same thing.  I started calling around to Nurserys looking for them and found out that no one can get them this year.  They said there is a shortage of them and no one has them for sale.   

Karen, I loved seeing the picture of your pot.  How many plants are in there?  Are they planted directly in that pot or in individual pots?  It is very beautiful and inspiring!!!  Thanks for sharing it.   

Funny, but I have a lotus in a whiskey barrel liner that I dug out of the ground to put in a whiskey barrel, but now I can't find the whiskey barrels either! What's the deal with that?! Have they fallen THAT far out of popularity?

Thanks about the pics. The plants were planted in individual pots. The water lily was actually one plant, it just had a mutated flower that was white. I have a funny feeling that snails had something to do with it. Can snails suck the color out of a water lily bud? I had a snail infestation that year. All the subsequent flowers were purple. I even sent some to Marilyn and they were all purple. There was some Duckweed in there, some Dwarf Cattail, and (cognitive decline)- Lizard tail...or Pickerel...? Ahh the joys of aging. 

You can buy taro tubers at veggie markets and grow them yourself, unless you want fancy varieties. There was a very intelligent person here once, Teresa, who said to start the 'veggie market' Taro tubers in dry soil, don't water until they have their first leaves, and it worked like a charm. The Taro tubers around here are only 1.99/lb, so you can get a lot of them for cheap. Once they get leaves, they can handle the water. Not all of them will grow, but at 1.99/lb, it's a good deal.

Last year in that pot I grew Castor Bean plants. Beautiful, but a tad too poisonous for my curious son. 

[Lisa816]

Karen, 2 different nurseries told me that all the whiskey barrels are being shipped over to Europe where they're selling for big bucks.  They said that's why there are none to be found here.   Sounds kind of weird.  I don't know if it's true, but I sure haven't been able to find one to buy.

What size pots where the lily and other marginals individually potted in? 

I got a dwarf giant Papyrus at Lowe's.  I haven't repotted it yet, but took it out of the little blue water container and put it down into the rope handle tote with my other water plants that are waiting to go in my pond.  The dwarf papyrus has tons of white roots coming out of the top of the pot now.  I guess it likes being out of that little blue container, but it looks like it desperately wants to be repotted into a bigger pot.

[Cedric]

Karen, 2 different nurseries told me that all the whiskey barrels are being shipped over to Europe where they're selling for big bucks. 

That sounds very weird. Europe has many of it's own, mostly wine barrels. They are very expensive, made from oak. There also a few manufacturers of them.

[tinkster]

My lowes has about 20 of then right now. just got them last week so maybe its just a bit early for yall????    They also have a knock off of the wooden ones in that ????? type of pop that is lightweight.  But its made to look just like the wooden ones.

tinkster

[Joyce]

Yup, like Cedric said, the wider, the better, and not very deep, 12" is good. Hardly any water over the top of the soil.
Although, when I repotted my full 1/2 barrel liners (20+ gallons size), the roots went all the way to the bottom, at least 18" deep.
And the tubers at the bottom were the biggest, the size of bananas! 
We have absolutely NO shortage of half wine barrels here. (this is wine country out here on the North Fork)
I don't believe the story that they are shipping them to Europe. 
Europe has just as many distilleries and wineries as we do, if not more.
So there would be no shortage of them in Europe either.

The only lotus that did OK in a somewhat smaller container was Baby Doll, a dwarf 'bowl' lotus.
That container was about 22" wide and 8" deep.
I don't believe in growing in clay.
I believe compost is richer, holds more nutrients, more like what they grow in their natural habitat:
the decaying composted organic matter that settles out into a thick layer of composted mulm on the bottom of ponds and bogs.
The lotus in the lotus pond at work literally clean the bottom of the pond by absorbing all that composted mulm. (which includes rotted plants, insects, koi poop, etc)
So by observation of the big lotus pond at work, I try to mimmick that in my container ponds here at home. And, for me, it works wonders, just giving them what they would naturally get.
Once again, my lotus have multiple daily blooms all summer. They start out having one or two a day, then when they really get going...at least 3 a day.
Somewhere here I have posted my lotus pots with 5-6, maybe even more blooms per barrel.   
That was Momo Botan, which I killed by dividing and sharing, and not leaving enough for myself.  :'(

[Julles]

I was at Nelson's Water Gardens in Katy (Houston), Texas yesterday, and noticed on their price list something called a faux barrel, with a seperate liner that fit into it.  I didn't note the price, and I don't know if they actually had any barrels there.  I also don't know if they ship.  But, if you can't find them locally, it might be worth contacting them.  They're pretty good about responding to e-mails.

 

http://nelsonwatergardens.com/

[Kat]

Joyce grows some fantastic lotus 

[Lisa816]

I don't believe the story that they are shipping them to Europe. 
Europe has just as many distilleries and wineries as we do, if not more.
So there would be no shortage of them in Europe either.

I thought that sounded far fetched too.  I don't know why they would say that.  Maybe someone told them that as a joke and they believed it.  Wierd!!!
I'm going to keep looking for one.  If Tinkster's Lowe's just got them in, maybe we'll get some at the Lowe's here too.  

[Julles]

I think they meant they're shipping OAK over there, because Europe is old, and they've cut down all their useable trees, so, when they can no longer reuse a barrel and need a new one, they have to import WOOD to make barrels from, not the barrels themselves.

[karen J]

What size pots where the lily and other marginals individually potted in? 

No bigger than a 6" pot. I used bricks to place the pots at the right level. Higher for the marginals & lower for the lily.

Joyce, I lost my Momo Botan because of over fertilization.

Julles, I've seen those faux barrels with liner too. I wanna say they run around 70-80$.

[Desertponder]

You know, I've found that if it holds water you can make just about anything into a watergarden.
Put a mini lily such as Aurora or Helvola in there and maybe a marginal plant or two and you'll have yourself a small watergarden.
I wouldn't let that container get full sun all day long or it will get pretty hot.

but now I can't find the whiskey barrels either! What's the deal with that?! Have they fallen THAT far out of popularity?

We haven't seen the usual amount of half barrels here this year. Home Depot hasn't had any at all this year.
A farm & feed place that normally has them every year has probably half the stock they normally do and the price on them doubled. Last year they were $15.99 and this year they are $34.99.

[Joyce]

I would like to get my hands on some of the NICE faux wine barrels.
But like Karen said, they are not cheap, even half price.

[miguynmkoi]

Back in March I went to Napa Valley for wine tasting and stocking up on some deals and came across wine barrels for sale at many wineries.  I bought a whole French oak barrel in great condition for $15.  Barrel is bigger than a whiskey barrel.  Then wine aroma is incredible when I pull the stopper out. 

Most wineries in California sell their barrels for a steal but you have to carry it home.  From what I've seen prices range from $15 to $50 (different wineries) for a whole barrel in just used condition.  Next trip I'll have to get more for lotus!  I'm keeping it as a wine table in the backyard.  Cheers! 

[Joyce]

Yep, we have the wine barrels here too, and the aroma can be overwhelming especially if it is a red wine barrel.

[Cedric]

It's a misnomer that clay is not fertile. It's absolutely the most fertile soil there is.

The problem in terrestrial gardens, and where the misnomer originates in the West, is that plant roots cannot access clay as it is mostly too hard for fine roots to penetrate, and it holds water something most terrestrials also dislike. Lotus growing in Asia do the absolute best in clay ponds with deep clay bottoms. Clay in water is soft so roots easily get to the nutrients. Using pure clay you don't have to fertilise at all, very useful to keeping water crystal clear, also the planting medium remains as sweet as when you first put it in, reducing chances of precious water lilies rotting. Using clay you can also get away with much much smaller pots for things like lotus, as long as you repot each year or make divisions of the tubers when they get too large. And for water-lilies a even 20-cm diameter pot is more than adequate. Soft grey and red mix clay is sold in water tight vacuum packed packets here especially for lotus.

Also water lilies and lotus do not need oxygen around the roots, the roots have evolved to cope with no oxygen by having air chambers in them.

The thing I love about clay too is when you need to pull a plant up you just plunge your hand into the medium and grip the plant and pull, everything comes out in one undamaged gloop, like a large octopus unravelling. Same for planting just push the plant in as you open your hand spreading the roots and that's that, no need to weigh it down, the vacuum in clay holds it fast.

I brought back some lilies from Thailand, all leaves and flowers removed, roots trimmed to five cm. In only two weeks "The King of Siam" has already got two flower buds on the verge of opening and twelve large leaves the other lilies close behind. Clay is marvellous it really is. Though I love reading everyone's receipts for planting medium. I have tried so many myself and am always open to new and interesting ideas. But for simplicity and ease of use I personally am hooked on clay. As Karen was lamenting, it's also impossible to kill a lily or lotus from fertiliser mishap grown this way.